268 replies to this topic

[china cat]

apostate

[Tim the Beek]

grows larger as a fella gets older, I'm told.

Oh, wait...

[Jersey Thug]

sillies.

[ladygingechilla]

[Tim the Beek]

[Ginger Snap]

yup. we're actually in the phasing out stage now, on our way to full-on Esselstyn. currently struggling with the concept of abandoning avocados, olive oil and nuts. and in my case oh yeah...the occasional steak or hamburger.

admittedly, i have a LOT more to phase out than kiltboy does. but we're doing pretty good so far. small amounts of olive oil and nut butter (that's for you, Depends) but overall, i'm happy with the changes we've made so far and i don't think it's going to be as impossible to adhere to as i first thought.

but truly, Dr. Esselstyn is a fucking sadist

I'm curious why the need to not eat avocado and nuts.

[Depends]

I have been reading up on gluten free casein free diet being helpful with kids on the autism spectrum. I think sooner, rather than later, my son & I will be vegan.

(I don't know which of us will miss pizza more....)

[Tim the Beek]

I'm curious why the need to not eat avocado and nuts.

Fat content.

[Tim the Beek]

I'm havin' a vegan Monday in Western CT.

[Ginger Snap]

Fat content.

So the diet means to have one consume the calories needed through carbs and protein alone? Does it not follow this standard for protein/carb/fat ratio of calorie consumption?

"For adults, proteins should be between 10 and 35 percent of the diet, fats between 20 and 35 percent and carbohydrates between 45 and 65 percent."

Read more: http://www.livestron.../#ixzz2Ch81QKwU

[Tim the Beek]

So the diet means to have one consume the calories needed through carbs and protein alone? Does it not follow this standard for protein/carb/fat ratio of calorie consumption?

"For adults, proteins should be between 10 and 35 percent of the diet, fats between 20 and 35 percent and carbohydrates between 45 and 65 percent."

Read more: http://www.livestron.../#ixzz2Ch81QKwU

My understand, and Thuggie can tell you better than I, that it's a plant-based diet, which, while not fatless, aims to avoid higher fat items...

[Ginger Snap]

When I was doing the raw food thing, I had a really difficult time getting the calories I needed to sustain throughout the day. And I felt like I was eating all the time too. Working out? Forget it- I was just too weak. But I could count on avocados and nuts for energy. Just curious- not passing judgement or anything- I was just surprised about no nuts and avocado.

[china cat]

omg

https://www.youtube....&v=MU2X88ooLoc#!

[china cat]

[china cat]

lol

[Tim the Beek]

[scarfire]

no avacados? i thought they're a "super food"!?!?! they're a staple in my diet.

this thanksgiving is my one year meat-free anniversary. i was thinking about what i'll eat in place of all the meat dishes
when i sit down for thanksgiving dinner w/the family. no problem there - so many choices.

i've been buying the daiya vegan cheeses from fairway lately and they've really grown on me. they melt well - especially in my bean burritos which i eat 2-3 times a week,

[china cat]

[china cat]

no avacados? i thought they're a "super food"!?!?! they're a staple in my diet.

this thanksgiving is my one year meat-free anniversary. i was thinking about what i'll eat in place of all the meat dishes
when i sit down for thanksgiving dinner w/the family. no problem there - so many choices.

i've been buying the daiya vegan cheeses from fairway lately and they've really grown on me. they melt well - especially in my bean burritos which i eat 2-3 times a week,

I haven't tried the vegan cheeses. I use the vegan sour cream but I gotta say, lookin at the ingredients...well, I don't know what they are - seems processed. I think the move away from dairy won't lead me to fake dairy for this reason.

[Tim the Beek]

no avacados? i thought they're a "super food"!?!?! they're a staple in my diet.

this thanksgiving is my one year meat-free anniversary. i was thinking about what i'll eat in place of all the meat dishes
when i sit down for thanksgiving dinner w/the family. no problem there - so many choices.

i've been buying the daiya vegan cheeses from fairway lately and they've really grown on me. they melt well - especially in my bean burritos which i eat 2-3 times a week,

The Esselstyn diet is very low in fat...even "good" fats. More power to anyone who can swing it...

[Jersey Thug]

I'm curious why the need to not eat avocado and nuts.

for Jason, the decision is medical. his body doesn't seem to know the difference between good fats and bad ones. but even if his cholesterol stays sky high for the remainder of his life (a genetic issue, not diet based, clearly - overall, he has the healthiest diet of just about anyone i have ever known, and has eaten this way for 15+ years) if there is nothing in his diet that can clog his arteries, heart disease won't be an issue for him.

since he's exhibited some early signs of vascular disease, the only proven way for him to reverse the damage already done and stave off life-threatening complications is to make radical changes to his diet and stick to vegan, plant-based foods with no added fats, and to avoid natural foods that are high in fat. that includes tree nuts, seeds, coconut water and avocados.

as for energy, as long as you consume enough calories (which hasn't been an issue for us) after the first week or two that's usually not an issue, and hasn't been for him. he's needed a LOT of energy to demolish his parents' house the past few weeks. there are many athletes who follow the same diet and it doesn't hold them back. the truth is, fat (even "good" fat) doesn't have any nutritive value, and once our bodies adjust to not having it and the cravings stop, we're stronger and healthier for not having it.

plenty of people can live long lives no matter what they eat. but for some, it takes work. in his shoes, most people would gladly pop a pill and keep eating whatever they want in "moderation", dealing with the consequences later with medical intervention... but that's just not his way. and i support his choice, so in our home this is the way we do things. when i'm out i don't follow Esselstyn to the letter because it's not medically necessary for me, and because i have my own dietary needs that are restrictive enough on their own...but at home, we support each other 100% and you won't find anything here that either of us can't have.

it's not always easy, especially for him when he's not at home for a meal...but it has its benefits in the last month we've both had noticeable improvements in our overall health...lower blood pressure, weight loss, increased energy, concentration and brain function. i finally kicked my sugar addiction, and though he's never had a sweet tooth, he went through a similar process a week later, with simple carbs.

so while it may not be for everyone, it's definitely working for us.

[Jersey Thug]

I haven't tried the vegan cheeses. I use the vegan sour cream but I gotta say, lookin at the ingredients...well, I don't know what they are - seems processed. I think the move away from dairy won't lead me to fake dairy for this reason.

ditto. even when we weren't oil free, those processed products weren't very attractive to either of us. used occasionally (like any other junk food) i guess they aren't horrible for the average person, but there really isn't anything nutritionally beneficial about them. what i found when i did use the processed stuff (soy- and wheat-based proteins, or soy cream cheese and sour cream) was, it was easy to be less mindful of overall nutrition while eating them and because of that it's easy to be a vegetarian - even a vegan - and still have a fairly unhealthy diet. in the end, processed is still processed no matter what's in it and while it might be useful as a replacement from time to time, it's not adding anything beneficial to your diet so it's good to keep that in mind.

[scarfire]

you're right about the daiya cheese. high in fat and not much nutrition.

i suppose it's only advantage is that is is cruelty free, so i keep some on hand when i feel like eating junk.

[Tim the Beek]

We watched Vegucated* yesterday (trailer below). Has me thinking more and more that vegan is the way to go for me. The movie itself has some rough scenes, but the concept is pretty cool.

Gonna try...not try, do...at least one vegan meal per day...maybe more...and build on that.





*streamable on Amazon, or according to the movie site, Netflix, for anyone who's interested.

[Eco]

Trailer looks good, will have to catch the full movie on Netflix. I have another 11-12 days until I switch over to vegan which should be pretty easy since I gave up eggs a couple of weeks ago so it's just the dairy products left to give up. Only issue as of now is having to google about every fuc-ing product to see if it's vegan....even some beers are not vegan. Sort of lucky doing vegan raw at my apartment now for months and having a hippie gf that watches every ingredient in the excellent food she cooks for me a few times a week. Just gotta source vegan food for work lunches or pack my meals.

Good idea taking baby steps Tim.

[china cat]

Bravo, Eco. It takes an enormous amount of planning and commitment to stop consuming all animal products.

I always thought that organic animal products were produced with less cruelty but the video above shows that mistreatment abounds.

Tim and I are starting with a few vegan meals a week. We're going to have to learn to cook in different ways with different ingredients. And, I gather that eating out will be near impossible. I don't think I'll deny meals that are made with animal product, if the meals are made by others (too much work to ask of those who invite us to dinner, etc.) Taking baby steps.

It'll be interesting to see where we are a year from now. But I do know that we'd like to live cruelty free and we're on a path to making that happen.

[Ginger Snap]

oh thank god youre still leaving room for dinner with me.

[china cat]

I can't finish watching

[Tim the Beek]

Watched the whole thing...more motivation...

[china cat]

Just passed the 2 year anniversary of no meat 12/26

Tim and I had a $175 carriage worth of food yesterday, all cruelty free.

Livin and eatin well. Feels good

[Tooozday]

What are your criteria for cruelty free foods?

[china cat]

Hi T

trying to ensure no animal cruelty, which does not necessarily require veganism. for example we had waffles with eggs but the eggs came from Tim's own chickens

(though, i suppose to be 100% true to the cruelty free label, we should also make sure the food we buy was uses fair labor practices.)

[Tooozday]

Just wondering what "cruelty free" means to you. I struggle with the concept at times. Perhaps people have different definitions of cruelty? One sis of mine will go hungry rather than eat non-organic; I prefer to eat locally grown (so's I can visit with my veggies before chomping them all up) but can handle some chemical fertilizers as a trade-off for the fuel that flies the beautiful fruits from far-away countries.
Anyways, I bet Tim has happy hens that are glad to kick over a few eggs now and again.

[china cat]

Just wondering what "cruelty free" means to you. I struggle with the concept at times. Perhaps people have different definitions of cruelty? One sis of mine will go hungry rather than eat non-organic; I prefer to eat locally grown (so's I can visit with my veggies before chomping them all up) but can handle some chemical fertilizers as a trade-off for the fuel that flies the beautiful fruits from far-away countries.
Anyways, I bet Tim has happy hens that are glad to kick over a few eggs now and again.

cruelty free, for me, means the suffering of a sentient being has been avoided in the production of the food

I'm sure Tim will comment here but he much agrees with local before organic, though, obviously both are preferred. The carbon footprint is a large reason but it's also essential to support small, local growers

[Tim the Beek]

Couldn't have said it better myself.

One small addition...from what I've read, even if they aren't doing "organic," smaller, local "conventional" growers tend to use fewer chemical inputs than big, centralized ag operations do.

[Depends]

During the growing season, I support a local farm. They are not certified organic, according to them, getting that badge is very expensive, but they follow organic practices. I guess what that means is that I trust them to be telling the truth about how they farm. I speak with them almost daily, during season, and they are dedicated to safe sane food.
They also have chickens that are raised in a field, with an old school hen house. I have been on a tour of the farm, and can't see any cruelty.
They also sell other items, that they do not produce, but they ensure that those items are non GMO, and as "organic" as possible. Those include tree fruits, and local cheeses and honey.

I always thought it was too expensive to shop at a farm, but it really isn't. The produce I buy there NEVER goes to waste. Some item are even cheaper than in the big supermarket.

I'm proud of my little farm, they have had a CSA for a few years, I was in it the first year, and will be joining again this year. The biggest benefit that Ive found with a CSA is the variety of vegetables that they offer. Many of which I never would have tried on my own, but actually loved them.

[Depends]

Also, the coffee I buy is from an American farm(Hawaii), 100% certified organic. Also 100% delish.

www.konapurplemountain.com

[Tooozday]

CSA's are a great option. It usually give the farm a capital injection when the farm needs it most; it also brings the non-farmer people closer to their food and where it comes from.

[Eco]

Tim and I are starting with a few vegan meals a week. We're going to have to learn to cook in different ways with different ingredients. And, I gather that eating out will be near impossible.

If you like Asian food it's not that hard. I've been eating mostly Asian food...it's yummy, tastes great is is very very easy on the food budget if you buy it from the Chinaman markets. Just sort of have to watch sodium intake since most of the yummy sauces are loaded.

I tried some vegan products with mixed reviews:

- The cheese sort of sucks but I was able to make some toasted "cheese" sandwiches which I thought were passable in part because they were on really good bread and dumped into an excellent homemade soup.

-Vegan butter.....yeah it's not Cabot but it works.

-Vegan meatballs.....a little on the soft side but passable.

-Vegan sausage......sort of horrible and burns really quick on a cast iron pan. Reheated it picks up a undelightful texture of overcooked calimari.

-Two brands of vegan cream cheese, one sucked really bad and the other was passable with some added hot sauce.

Eating out has been a real challenge aside from Asian places and two veggie/vegan places in Providence. Most places offer nothing I can eat unless I have them delete some of what makes it a meal. Salad and french fries (? on if they are vegan) are not a proper meal.... All bitching aside, it's a fun challenge and I feel much better living this lifestyle.

[china cat]

Hi Eco

Yeah, we tried the Daiya cheese and the vegan cream cheese - gross! (the sour cream isn't bad if you use it as a veggie dip) Don't think we're lookin to the alternative dairy and "meats" just doin more with vegan soups, lots of bean/veg/pasta dishes.

There's a Thai place close by that we can get vegan meals but I think we're ok with nonvegan when we go out. We are gradually and mindfully cutting way back and that's more than most so we're feelin ok with the process.

[Depends]

the vegan cream cheese I tried, from Trader Joe's, defined gross. Everything about it sucked. The color, the texture, the smell, the taste...

I have tried a couple of vegan mozzerella cheeses, which I thought were OK. My kids won't go near the stuff.

I have tried a lot of the vegan meat things, but mostly stay with veggie burgers. I try to stay away from soy based products.

Today I have a GIANT lentil soup. Made with lentils, potatoes, carrots, and peppers. More than tasty....

[Jersey Thug]

Jason's description of the taste of vegan cheese (which i've never tried): buy a pack of Kraft singles. open the package and remove one cheese single, setting the rest of the package aside. unwrap your slice of cheese, and discard. eat the plastic.

yum

so far this week i've made veggie burritos (zucchini, corn, peppers: poblano, jalapeno, habanero, and bell, with spinach, cauliflower, cilantro, onion, and grilled wild sweet potato) with a delicious chipotle chili and tomato sauce in healthy wraps. once assembled i grilled them in the grill pan for a few minutes, then topped with the chipotle tomato sauce. served with black beans (from dried beans, so much better than canned) and wild rice on the side. no cheese or sour cream needed or wanted. they were awesome!

i made a kale and black bean stew with the leftover beans, and served that in oven-roasted acorn squash bowls. i think i liked this even better than the burritos. the acorn squash was so, so yummy and we both went back for more stew - my black beans always rock!

trying to decide what to make for dinner tonight. i've been missing Jason a lot the last couple of days (the first week back after a long break is always the toughest) so i want to make something i know he'll love but that contains no oils or animal products...and not southwestern or Mexican-inspired since we've been doing that the last few days and he always takes leftovers for lunches so i bet he's all set with that.

i'm thinking maybe potato/leek/habanero soup and a giant salad with kale and spinach.

[china cat]

Everybody to Thuggie's house!!!!

YUM!

[china cat]

(((Missin Jason)))

[china cat]

Today I have a GIANT lentil soup. Made with lentils, potatoes, carrots, and peppers. More than tasty....

then, a quick stop at Depend's!!!

[Depends]

Every week, I make some sort of dried bean/pea/lentil soup. I buy bags of beans at the market, and just start throwing them in a pot.
Black , navy, white , red beans. 16 bean soup, red lentils, yellow peas. I love them all.
But the pink beans. Whoa. They are special. Special as in special powers.

There is no way in the world a human should fart as much as that....

[Jersey Thug]

suggestion: buy some kombu (dry kelp) and toss it in the pot as you're soaking and/or cooking your beans.

it makes living with a vegan a LOT more pleasant

[Jersey Thug]

(((Missin Jason)))

oh, i see how it is.

[Ginger Snap]

I needed this thread- Ive been slipping all over the place and it doesn't feel good at all. Anyway, just wanted to pop in and thank thuggy for the burrito reminder- Abby loves mine and the kids liking my food is the best motivator there is so I know what I'll be doing on Saturday.

My folks got me a super cool wok for my gas stove for Christmas, so I'm hoping this winter maybe I can finally make a decent stir fry. It's ridiculous the things I have the most difficult time with everyone seems to think is so easy. My sauces are terrible.

Anyway...is it time to plant yet?

I really want to make a super amazing mole over the winter but Im used to eating it cooked into meat, so I'm still working out the preparation. Maybe served over fried plantains.

[Depends]

You can make vegetarian mole enchiladas. If you use tofu, get the super firm type, and freeze it. The texture changes, and works well in dishes like enchiladas and chili.