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#551 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 07:58 PM

Bummer about the singers, but Act 10 is a total hit. Results are still king. Thank goodness for that.



#552 JBetty

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 08:02 PM

Depends on how you measure the results.

If you only care about the money, you're prolly right.



#553 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 08:03 PM

I care most of all about people's ability to have liberty. The right to choose. Most aren't choosing unions. Which, also makes me giddy. Especially since it is in public sectors.



#554 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 05:36 PM

This is not nice at all.   :sad:

 

 

 

 

 

Wisconsin Capitol Police incident reports released with protesters' addresses, driver's license and Social Security numbers
Judith Davidoff on Monday 09/16/2013 5:33 pm, 

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Arthur Kohl-Riggs, who frequently shoots video of the noontime Solidarity Sing Along at the state Capitol - where protesters gather to oppose Gov. Scott Walker's policies and police ticket participants who refuse to get a permit - says he knows of at least 35 people whose personal information was released in police reports to others.

Spaulding alone, however, received personal information on more than 60 other individuals who were cited at the Capitol.

Dana Brueck, spokeswoman for the Department of Justice, was in a meeting Monday afternoon and did not immediately return a message left with a receptionist. The Department of Justice is prosecuting all of the Capitol citations except those that involve criminal charges.

Calls to Stephanie Marquis, spokeswoman for the Department of Administration, and the DOA media line were also not immediately returned.

Capitol Police, who compile the police reports, are part of the Department of Administration. The DOA legal department is responsible for furnishing the police reports to DOJ prosecutors or to individuals who ask for them through an open records request.

It is unclear why Spaulding and others were provided any information on other protesters or why sensitive personal information was not redacted before it was released. When the state Department of Revenue in 2012 published an annual sales report online that included the Social Security numbers of thousands of state residents who sold their homes in 2011, the state offered to pay for a year of credit-monitoring services for those affected.

Kohl-Riggs says the recent release of private information by Capitol Police could discourage protesters who fear their financial security will be compromised if they are arrested. "It seems a compelling reason to stay away," he says.

 

 

http://www.thedailyp...p?article=40925



#555 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:05 PM

So the Capitol Police aren't responsible for furnishing the reports to others but this Kohl-Riggs guy will still blame them for doing it while insinuating it's part of their tactic to keep protesters away. Anything to further the cause, truth be damned.

 

Not nice at all, indeed.



#556 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:18 PM

How is it that the capitol police aren't responsible for their own reports?



#557 Depends

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:28 PM

But the Capitol Police are responsible for compiling the report.  I would be surprised if anyone, outside of a few insiders would know off hand whether it is the Cap Police, or the DOA Legal dept who redacts SS#s and the like. 

 

But anything to throw peaceful protesters under the bus, it does further someone's cause.

 

So, was it an honest mistake?  Was it on purpose?  Who knows, but if it was my SS#, I would be shouting at the top of my lungs.

 

Couldn't you just say it is WRONG, that it should not have happened. That it was the fault of the DOA, either legal dept, or Cap Police?  Rather than blaming the victim here?

 

Or are you just pointing it out to further your cause?



#558 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:30 PM

They're not responsible for furnishing the reports to others. It's the DoA that handles that and would most likely be responsible for redacting the proper info before distributing it to others.

 

The DOA legal department is responsible for furnishing the police reports to DOJ prosecutors or to individuals who ask for them through an open records request.



#559 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:33 PM

DOA or Capitol Police - it doesn't really matter.

Point is that these people's private information is being spread around and that is just not right.



#560 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:35 PM

But the Capitol Police are responsible for compiling the report.  I would be surprised if anyone, outside of a few insiders would know off hand whether it is the Cap Police, or the DOA Legal dept who redacts SS#s and the like. 

 

But anything to throw peaceful protesters under the bus, it does further someone's cause.

 

So, was it an honest mistake?  Was it on purpose?  Who knows, but if it was my SS#, I would be shouting at the top of my lungs.

 

Couldn't you just say it is WRONG, that it should not have happened. That it was the fault of the DOA, either legal dept, or Cap Police?  Rather than blaming the victim here?

 

Or are you just pointing it out to further your cause?

Honestly I couldn't care less about the guy if he's willing to accuse and throw others under the bus. 

 

It is wrong it happened but it could very well be just a simple mistake and not the evil plot by the Capitol Police like he's making it out to be.



#561 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:36 PM

DOA or Capitol Police - it doesn't really matter.

Point is that these people's private information is being spread around and that is just not right.

It IS wrong and it does matter when you're falsely accusing others



#562 MeOmYo

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:41 PM

but police don't make mistakes



#563 Depends

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:41 PM

Who is falsely accusing?  Does anybody know who is responsible for the redaction of SS#'s?



#564 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 06:43 PM

If it was my information I wouldn't give a flying fuck about who did it and blame them both equally.

And given the state of affairs out there, I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out it was no mistake.



#565 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:02 PM

Who is falsely accusing?  Does anybody know who is responsible for the redaction of SS#'s?

One of the regular protesters down there, Arthur Kohl-Riggs is the one accusing the Cap. Police of releasing private information.

 

I imagine it would be the DoA who is responsible for redacting the info as it's their job to furnish the reports to others. 



#566 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:07 PM

The DoA has lied to the people of Wisconsin so many times, this is not surprising at all.



#567 Depends

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:11 PM

One of the regular protesters down there, Arthur Kohl-Riggs is the one accusing the Cap. Police of releasing private information.

 

I imagine it would be the DoA who is responsible for redacting the info as it's their job to furnish the reports to others. 

The Cap Police are part of the DOA.

 

Do you know, without guessing, who is responsible for redacting the info within the DoA?  Cap Police, or DoA Legal?



#568 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:18 PM

The Cap Police are part of the DOA.

 

Do you know, without guessing, who is responsible for redacting the info within the DoA?  Cap Police, or DoA Legal?

No, I can't say with 100% certainty but I can't see it being the police responsibility to do the redacting. The paperwork would be more on the administrative/legal end and the cops wouldn't be responsible for distributing it to others. It's most likely just an administrative screw up but anything is possible.



#569 Depends

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:21 PM

No, I can't say with 100% certainty but I can't see it being the police responsibility to do the redacting. The paperwork would be more on the administrative/legal end and the cops wouldn't be responsible for distributing it to others. It's most likely just an administrative screw up but anything is possible.

And do you find it ironic that you will freely accuse Mr. Kohl-Riggs of false accusation, when you yourself are not certain of who is responsible?



#570 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:35 PM

Get with the program, Depends.

 

Good Cop - Bad Citizen

Anything to further the cause, truth be damned.



#571 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:36 PM

And do you find it ironic that you will freely accuse Mr. Kohl-Riggs of false accusation, when you yourself are not certain of who is responsible?

No, because what I'm accusing him of is falsely accusing the cops of furnishing the reports to others not whether or not they're responsible for redacting them.

 

So the Capitol Police aren't responsible for furnishing the reports to others but this Kohl-Riggs guy will still blame them for doing it while insinuating it's part of their tactic to keep protesters away. Anything to further the cause, truth be damned.

 

Not nice at all, indeed.



#572 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:39 PM

Get with the program, Depends.

 

Good Cop - Bad Citizen

Anything to further the cause, truth be damned.

 

:titiping:

 

 

My cause IS the truth   ;)



#573 Depends

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 08:07 PM

You dance pretty well for a large man.  :rolling:

 

Nowhere in the article I read did Mr. Kohl-Riggs say that Cap Police furnished reports to anyone.  Those are your words. 

 

What it said in the article :

 

"Kohl-Riggs says the recent release of private information by Capitol Police could discourage protesters who fear their financial security will be compromised if they are arrested. "It seems a compelling reason to stay away," he says."

 

So I ask you for a yes or no answer. Did the Capitol Police release private information?  IMO, yes.  They released it to the legal dept.  The Capitol police had possesion of the material.  It got into the hands of people that should not have had it.

 

If I had you hold onto $5 of my money, and you gave it to JBetty for safekeeping, and she spent it on singing lessons for her parents, would I be wrong in saying that Joker lost my $5?



#574 JBetty

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 08:26 PM

If I had you hold onto $5 of my money, and you gave it to JBetty for safekeeping, and she spent it on singing lessons for her parents, would I be wrong in saying that Joker lost my $5?

 

 

 

Depends

 

 

:rolling:



#575 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 08:49 PM

You dance pretty well for a large man.  :rolling:

 

Nowhere in the article I read did Mr. Kohl-Riggs say that Cap Police furnished reports to anyone.  Those are your words. 

 

What it said in the article :

 

"Kohl-Riggs says the recent release of private information by Capitol Police could discourage protesters who fear their financial security will be compromised if they are arrested. "It seems a compelling reason to stay away," he says."

 

So I ask you for a yes or no answer. Did the Capitol Police release private information?  IMO, yes.  They released it to the legal dept.  The Capitol police had possesion of the material.  It got into the hands of people that should not have had it.

 

If I had you hold onto $5 of my money, and you gave it to JBetty for safekeeping, and she spent it on singing lessons for her parents, would I be wrong in saying that Joker lost my $5?

Float like a butterball, sting like a bee

 

Yeah he said the release of private information which is the same as the furnishing of it.

 

No, the Capitol Police are part of the DoA that's the dept./division that would handle the paperwork normally. AFAIK they didn't give it to anyone that they shouldn't have given it to.

 

If you gave me $5 to hold I wouldn't give it to anyone else (and you'd be lucky to get it back from me smartass)



#576 Depends

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 08:54 PM

prolly buy a case of the so called beer you drink, then give me the change, prolly



#577 Joker

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 08:58 PM

 I know you remember way back when we COULD buy a case for less than that. Ahhh the good old days.   



#578 JBetty

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 06:17 PM

 

 

 

 

Dane County DA declines to press felony battery charges against Damon Terrell
Monday 09/23/2013 10:11 am
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"We had some questions and we didn't believe we could reach our burden," Ozanne said Monday morning.

Terrell was also facing tentative charges of resisting arrest and disorderly conduct.

A call for comment to the Department of Administration, which oversees the Capitol police, was not immediately returned.

According to Madison criminal defense attorney Robert Ruth, a number of factors must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt to be convicted of battery to a police officer under Wisconsin law. Included among them is that the defendant caused bodily harm to a person and that the defendant's conduct was a substantial factor in producing the bodily harm.

Bodily harm means "physical pain or injury, illness or any impairment of physical condition," according to Ruth. Felony battery to a police officer is punishable by up to three and a half years in prison and a fine up to $10,000.

Terrell was arrested Aug. 26 at the state Capitol during the noontime Solidarity Sing Along, which has become a daily protest of Gov. Scott Walker's policies. Observers and protesters caught the violent arrest of Terrell by Capitol police on video, which was posted online.

Terrell's arrest stood out because of the police force used to arrest him and because his tentative felony battery charge was the most serious against a protester or observer since police first began issuing tickets at the sing-along in September 2012.

Terrell's initial appearance before a court commissioner was originally scheduled for Sept. 12 but Ozanne said he needed more time to review police evidence so the hearing was postponed until Sept. 23.

Capitol Police Officer James Brooks, one of the arresting officers, testified in a probable cause affidavit and judicial determination that he hurt his finger and received multiple abrasions and lacerations while trying to subdue Terrell.

Terrell appeared before a Dane County court commissioner for a bail bond hearing on Aug. 29, three days after his arrest. He was released on a signature bond. Ozanne said at the time that he had received information from the police just the day before and needed more time to review the incident report and determine appropriate charges.

Terrell is a longtime Capitol protester. On Aug. 26, multiple videos captured footage of him holding a camera as he stood in the center of the Capitol Rotunda. Terrell could be heard telling officers "this isn't illegal" as they approached him. The videos show Damon backing away before officers grabbed him and threw him to the floor. After a 30-second struggle, officers carried Terrell away.

Stephanie Marquis, spokeswoman for the Department of Administration, issued a statement on the incident, saying that Terrell "refused to leave and actively resisted officers" when placed under arrest.

As of Friday Ozanne was still reviewing evidence. "I got the police reports and requested video," he said. Ozanne said he asked for video taken by Capitol police as well as any other video the department knew of, including those not taken by law enforcement.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is the guy who had to spend 3 days in jail after the capitol police attacked him while he was slowly backing away while holding his video camera.



#579 Joker

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 07:24 PM

This is the guy who had to spend 3 days in jail after the capitol police attacked him while he was slowly backing away while holding his video camera.

 

They attacked him?

 

Looks like the cops are trying to stop and/or arrest him and he's attempting to get away from them. He contacts and trips over the cop who is arresting his brother while hitting the arm of another cop who is dealing with a guy (in the white shirt) who is sticking a camera in his face and then he gets taken down.

 

Once he made contact with the cop trying to arrest his brother they pretty much had enough to take him in. Since he did it while trying to get away from the cops, tackling him trying to escape sure seems justifiable. 

 

Good to see they didn't push the charges.



#580 JBetty

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 07:36 PM

Yeah - they pretty much backed him directly into that situation.

Dude didn't have a chance.



#581 Joker

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 08:08 PM

If only there had been someone there to take responsibility for the actions of his feet.   :picardfp:



#582 JBetty

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 08:22 PM

Oh please, the guy was no threat at all until they jumped on him.

Then they left him in jail for three days because the cops couldn't get their shit together (and probably their stories straight) and file the appropriate reports.  :rolleyes:

Not to mention the ridiculous felony battery charge when the cops were clearly the aggressors.

Another bullshit charge from the rotunda thrown out of court.  

I've lost count, but I think it's over 50 BS charges that have been tossed so far.

I hear a class action law suit is in the works.

Should be interesting to see how that plays out in court.



#583 Joker

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 09:18 PM

You might not see it as a threat but that entire incident could have easily escalated.

 

The incident wouldn't have happened at all if the guy had just stopped and not backed over the cop. What was he thinking? Was everyone supposed to step aside as he blindly back pedaled trying to get away? He was a dumb fuck, plain and simple. That's probably why they left him in there for three days. 

 

 

Do you honestly think the cops were the aggressors for trying to stop someone who was trying to get away from them and was crashing into them while trying to do it?

 

FTR, despite what you say, it was neither a bullshit charge (the video clearly shows him resisting and initiating contact with multiple officers) nor was it thrown out of court (the DA chose not to take it to court, possibly with the ok from the cops.)

 

Yes it will undoubtedlyl be interesting to see if he presses charges or if any of the others who have been so terribly attacked do.  



#584 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 05:46 PM

You might not see it as a threat but that entire incident could have easily escalated.

 

 

Yes.  

Interesting how things have escalated due to the change in police behavior, not the singers behavior.



#585 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 05:47 PM

Technically, the case wasn't "lost", but the trumped up charges were tossed out, as so many other charges have been.
 
 
 
 
 
 
Walker’s Cops Lose Case, Face Civil Suit
By Rebecca Kemble, September 24, 2013
 

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Damon Terrell finally got his day in court yesterday more than four weeks after he was tackled and driven to the floor by Capitol Police officers, handcuffed, and arrested for felony battery of a police officer. He spent three days in jail awaiting arraignment. On August 29 Terrell was released on a signature bond with the condition that he not enter the Capitol building.

Dane County District Attorney Ismael Ozanne asked the arraignment judge to schedule a charging hearing for September 12 so that he could thoroughly examine the police reports and video evidence to determine what, if any, charges to bring against Terrell. At that hearing Ozanne said he was still sorting through the evidence and needed until September 23 to make a decision.

Yesterday DA Ozanne declined to prosecute any of the charges leveled against Terrell by the Capitol Police: felony battery of a police officer and misdemeanor resisting arrest and disorderly conduct. Ozanne said that after a thorough review of the evidence, there was not enough to meet the burden of proof required to make the charges stick in court.

 

Terrell still may face a civil forfeiture charge of unlawful assembly, even though he was present at the Capitol on August 26 to observe and photograph the arrests of people who were participating in the daily Solidarity Sing Along, not to participate in the gathering itself.

DA Ozanne at Damon Terrell's arraignment on August 29, 2013. Photo by Rebecca Kemble rk924b.jpg

Now that he’s off the hook for what appear to be trumped up charges against him, Damon Terrell will be pursuing a civil rights action against the police officers involved with his arrest and the Capitol Police department itself. Part of that lawsuit will likely involve a request for an injunction against any further arrests for singing – or reporting on singing – in the Capitol.

Videos of Terrell’s violent arrest have generated widespread public outrage and an outpouring of support for the Solidarity Sing Along from across the state. Former state banking commissioner Bill Dixon said, “This is merely one of dozens (of arrests) where dozens of videos and witness statements support charges that the Capitol Police engage, with regularity, in breaking the law, and perjuring themselves in their statements--with the support and, likely, encouragement of Walker, his staff, and the hierarchy of the Department of Administration.” He added, “It is long past time for some public official to call out, and stop, this out of control force which far too often acts like they are at a lunch counter, bus terminal, or the Edmund Pettus Bridge in Selma in the 1960s.”

Between July 24, 2013, and September 6, 2013, a total of 186 people have been arrested in the Capitol and issued a total of 350 citations. Many of those people have attended their initial court appearances, registered a plea of not guilty or they stood mute, and requested jury trials.

Sixteen criminal charges – including criminal resisting arrest, obstructing, battery of a police officer and criminal trespassing of a dwelling – have been leveled against a dozen or so people, includingThe Progressive Senior Editor Matt Rothschild. District Attorney Ozanne has declined to prosecute Rothschild and most of the rest of them.

There have been no arrests at the Capitol since September 6, and the emergency rules under which the citations were written expired September 12. The Department of Administration has not requested an extension of the rules, nor has it introduced a permanent version of them.

It is not clear what the Walker administration’s next strategy for combating the Sing Along will be since the mass arrests have failed to do anything but amplify the voices of those they would silence.

Neither Capitol Police Chief David Erwin nor Department of Administration Public Information Officer Stephanie Marquis has responded to requests for interviews on the subject. They are likely up to their eyeballs in paperwork preparing for potentially 350 jury trials over the next several months.

The strategy for those participating in the Solidarity Sing Along remains exactly the same as it was the day it began on March 11, 2011: Come to the Capitol at noon, sing for an hour, return the next day and do it again.



#586 Joker

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:12 PM

Yes.  

Interesting how things have escalated due to the change in police behavior, not the singers behavior.

Seems it's the singer's behavior, their refusing to get a permit, that is the cause for the police having to take any action at all against them. The cops are just doing their job.

 

And yet another article where the author just makes shit up in order to further the agenda and incite the masses rather than writing facts. 

 

So what exactly were the "trumped up charges" that were tossed out?



#587 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:22 PM

Seems it was the lawmakers behavior that started all this nonsense when they made a new law targeting the singers, when they could have just let all the lololdpeople peacefully sing their protest songs for an hour and then go home for nap time.

 

:circle:



#588 Joker

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:33 PM

I'm pretty sure the law requiring a permit for the rotunda has been in place since well before the singers started their protest.

 

 

 

 

So what exactly were the "trumped up charges" that were tossed out?


#589 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:34 PM

Oh yeah... trumped up charges include felony battery of an officer.

Watch the videos.   

The guy most definitely did NOT attack an officer, and any physical contact by him was purely accidental.

 



#590 Depends

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:39 PM

I'm pretty sure the law requiring a permit for the rotunda has been in place since well before the singers started their protest.

Possible.  But it wasn't until AFTER the protesting singers came along that the governor tried to pass a law that required groups of 4 or more to have permits.



#591 Joker

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:40 PM

He didn't have to attack the officer, he just had to cause the injury. There's nothing trumped up about the charge



#592 Joker

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:48 PM

Possible.  But it wasn't until AFTER the protesting singers came along that the governor tried to pass a law that required groups of 4 or more to have permits.

It's been on the books since 1979. That they want to put a number on the amount in the groups doesn't change the fact that they've still needed a permit all along.



#593 Depends

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 06:58 PM

All of a sudden they needed a number.  For 30 years they didn't.  Then all of a sudden they needed the number 4?

 

I'm sure many believe that needing a permit at all is wrong, and they are willing to be arrested for that belief.

 

But even you Jack, must admit that the number 4 is EXTREMELY low for a "crowd" or a "group".



#594 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:06 PM

He didn't have to attack the officer, he just had to cause the injury. There's nothing trumped up about the charge

 

 

He didn't cause the injury.

He was a spectator that the DOA said would not be arrested under the new rules.

He was backing away slowly and saying clearly that he wasn't doing anything illegal when the cops jumped him.

And it was another guy's wristwatch that caused the cut on the cop's finger.

 

But in Joker's world it's always Good Cop Bad Citizen, so I understand why you choose to interpret the events as you do.



#595 Joker

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:08 PM

Oh it was low and that's probably why the judge made it 20.



#596 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:18 PM

Oh it was low and that's probably why the judge made it 20.

 

 

 

For now.  We'll see if the whole deal holds up in court this winter.

But Walker et al's intent was clearly to get the singers out of the building, or at least make it extremely difficult for them.

Luckily, they were not stupid enough to get the permits or they'd be on the hook for all the police overtime and any other fees that might have been thrown at them.



#597 Joker

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:19 PM

He didn't cause the injury.

He was a spectator that the DOA said would not be arrested under the new rules.

He was backing away slowly and saying clearly that he wasn't doing anything illegal when the cops jumped him.

And it was another guy's wristwatch that caused the cut on the cop's finger.

 

But in Joker's world it's always Good Cop Bad Citizen, so I understand why you choose to interpret the events as you do.

The injury resulted from him resisting arrest, him backing away slowly is still resisting arrest. Resisting arrest IS illegal so yes, he was doing something illegal. Doesn't matter whose watch caused the cut, his resisting arrest caused the injury.

 

And if we're going to use incendiary terms like the cops jumped him, we'll go with he assaulted two cops while trying to escape from being arrested.

 

And again you're wrong when you say it's always good cop bad citizen but if that's what you have to go with then knock yourself out. Personally I'll continue trying to keep this discussion as civil as possible because I don't want any bad feelings between us over this.



#598 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:28 PM

And again you're wrong when you say it's always good cop bad citizen but if that's what you have to go with then knock yourself out. Personally I'll continue trying to keep this discussion as civil as possible because I don't want any bad feelings between us over this.

 

 

Show me one example - just one - of when you originally said the citizen was right and the cop was wrong.



#599 MeOmYo

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:31 PM

Personally I'll continue trying to keep this discussion as civil as possible because I don't want any bad feelings between us over this.

 

 

:lmao:

 

fucking hilarious



#600 JBetty

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 07:35 PM

BTW - I don't have any bad feelings towards you, Joker.   :heart:

I've been around this place long enough to know your shit stirring and cop apologist tendencies.

I know you'll never stop being a cop apologist, but I sometimes have a hard time trying to discern when you cease to be serious and you segue into shit stirring mode.