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Leaked Obama administration memo sets out case for killing US citizens


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#151 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:13 PM

I'll bet they were both connected to the used car salesman from Texas that allegedly hired a Mexican cartel hit squad to assassinate an embassador in DC.

 

ROFLMAO.

 

 

The underwear bomber

http://www.cbsnews.c...a-double-agent/



#152 Joker

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:45 PM

Dude, Obama labeled the underwear bomber a terrorist and thanks to him we were protected from that danger.

 

There's no way he'd lie to the American people and put the fear of an imminent attack in us unless it was the truth. He'd certainly never allow the crew and passengers on that plane to be terrorized by those in his own administration.



#153 TEO

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:53 PM

God Bless America

 

(Gotta have religion in our US politics.)



#154 TEO

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 07:11 PM

News orgs had ‘informal arrangement’ not to mention Saudi drone base

 

 

A media story lies at the center of a Washington Post article on the Obama administration’s targeted killing program. In the story, The Post reveals that the 2011 attack that killed U.S. citizen and al-Qaeda operative Anwar al-Awlaki was launched from a base in Saudi Arabia. That base, notes the story, was set up to combat al-Qaeda’s presence in the Arabian peninsula.
From there, Greg Miller and Karen DeYoung explain why news of the base is just now emerging:
 
The Washington Post had refrained from disclosing the location at the request of the administration, which cited concern that exposing the facility would undermine operations against an al-Qaeda affiliate regarded as the network’s most potent threat to the United States, as well as potentially damage counterterrorism collaboration with Saudi Arabia.
 
The Post learned Tuesday night that another news organization was planning to reveal the location of the base, effectively ending an informal arrangement among several news organizations that had been aware of the location for more than a year.
 
A fascinating bit of media economics, in other words. The Erik Wemple Blog is checking with The Post and other organizations about why they participated in this arrangement. It’s a dicey venture, too — withholding information about a program about which the public knows so little in the first place. More to come.
 
 


#155 TEO

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 07:13 PM

 

 

 

 

Published on May 30, 2012

DemocracyNow.org - The New York Times revealed this week that President Obama personally oversees a "secret kill list" containing the names and photos of individuals targeted for assassination in the U.S. drone war. According to the Times, Obama signs off on every targeted killing in Yemen and Somalia and the more complex or risky strikes in Pakistan. Individuals on the list include U.S. citizens, as well teenage girls as young as 17 years old. "The President of the United States believes he has the power to order people killed -- in total secrecy, without any due process, without transparency or oversight of any kind," says Glenn Greenwald, a constitutional law attorney and political and legal blogger for Salon.com. "I really do believe it's literally the most radical power that a government and president can seize, and yet the Obama administration has seized [it] and exercised it aggressively with little controversy."



#156 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 01:10 PM

Tabbooma has more faith in the goverment and President, everything seems to be the next big conspiracy

Dude, Obama labeled the underwear bomber a terrorist and thanks to him we were protected from that danger.

 

There's no way he'd lie to the American people and put the fear of an imminent attack in us unless it was the truth. He'd certainly never allow the crew and passengers on that plane to be terrorized by those in his own administration.



#157 TEO

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 03:38 PM

Interesting, can't trust them in regards to Wall Street and such, but can trust them to do what is best for the people.  



#158 Joker

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 03:52 PM

Don't forget that future administrations are going to have at least the same authority to do what Obama is doing now whether you have that same faith in them or not. Just imagine a Bush/Cheney White House with the "legal right" to target and kill Americans they deem "terrorists" while remembering that OWS protesters were treated and investigated as such even under Obama.

 

A little police pushing and pepper spraying will be the least of the worries for those protesting next time around.



#159 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:03 PM

Don't forget that future administrations are going to have at least the same authority to do what Obama is doing now whether you have that same faith in them or not. Just imagine a Bush/Cheney White House with the "legal right" to target and kill Americans they deem "terrorists" while remembering that OWS protesters were treated and investigated as such even under Obama.

 

A little police pushing and pepper spraying will be the least of the worries for those protesting next time around.

 

 

I think the point was made earlier in this threat that Bush and Cheney did just that.  They started a war versus terrorists even though there was no link.  Remember all the civilian casulties in the Iraq war?  

 

Hasn't it been stated by this administration that they wants to make sure there are rules and regulations are in place for DRONES and the current president and all future presidents, so that the power of the executive branch of government does not have to much power? 

 

Remember?  You posted a thread about it when this article came, and was one of the first times I responded to your Drone Thread campaign.

 

 

Obama 'drone-warfare rulebook' condemned by human rights groups

http://www.guardian....arfare-rulebook

 

I think their may have been over statement of power by the executive branch but at least they recognize this and are trying to put something in place.



#160 Uncle Coulro

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:33 PM

Tabbooma has more faith in the goverment and President

Why?



#161 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:45 PM

402665_485764504775178_1807627002_n.jpg
 



#162 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:55 PM

402665_485764504775178_1807627002_n.jpg

 

 

This comment is from 2008.

 

 

 

No one disputes that there is not an Islamic "Army".  They have bands of people that own assault weapons and bombs looking to do harm to developed countries where some autrocity has some side effect that bothers them.

 

Al queda is just a name.  Whatever the group is called, it does exist.



#163 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:59 PM

And further research shows Al-Qaida, literally means "the database".

 

My point is whatever Bush decided to call them, they are still identified as the lead terrorists.  No matter what their name is, there are people who want to do harm to developed countries.  See Spain, England, and many US embassy's.

 

That is what is called being a terrorist, the group's name is irrelevant.  IMO.



#164 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:09 PM

The name was given to so called "terrorists" by the CIA. And the former British Foreign Secretary is right. There is no islamic army or terrorist group. It's all a ruse to make imperialist policy appear legitimate to the masses who know only what the main stram media tells them.

 



#165 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:11 PM

Tabbooma has faith in the President, the man is more prevy to information than we will ever see regarding the targeting for Drone strikes, faith that the President has a plan to one day get us out of this mess, faith that the man really cares about people, that is why Tabbooma voted for him... Does Tabbooma entirely trust the goverment? That answer is no, clearly their are weasles in the govement but to Tabbooma this President looks at the information and makes the hard decisions, Tabbooma believes this President actually makes the final decisions and not easily swayed as past cowboy Presidents have been, Tabbooma believes there is good in people and this President is looking out for the best interest of all the people and not a select few.... Tabbooma does not dismiss conspiracy theorists, he actually finds them quite amusing, they are enttiled to their opinion as is Tabbooma.

Why?


#166 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:15 PM

Equating a local dick cop man handling Tabbooma's friends to the Presidents policy is quite reaching

Don't forget that future administrations are going to have at least the same authority to do what Obama is doing now whether you have that same faith in them or not. Just imagine a Bush/Cheney White House with the "legal right" to target and kill Americans they deem "terrorists" while remembering that OWS protesters were treated and investigated as such even under Obama.

 

A little police pushing and pepper spraying will be the least of the worries for those protesting next time around.



#167 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:39 PM

The name was given to so called "terrorists" by the CIA. And the former British Foreign Secretary is right. There is no islamic army or terrorist group. It's all a ruse to make imperialist policy appear legitimate to the masses who know only what the main stram media tells them.

 

 

I was with you until the end.

 

 

What would you call the group of individuals who are still planning ot want to do terrorist acts?  My point is name or no name, there is a group out there that is organized enough to pull off elaborate actions to cause terror.



#168 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:43 PM

They aren't organized. That is the point. These are people who wish to cause backlash, or as teh CIA puts it, blowback for foreign policy measures the US takes in a given region. NOW, the cat is out of the bag. Watch the power of Nightmares. This entire thing is completely manufactured. Completely. Now that the world at large believes in the mountian bunker sleeper cell high organized terror organization, they have claimed some legitimacy. They use this creation for power and for their cause. In 2001 and before there was NO SUCH THING as an organization, or any organized terrorism that spanned the globe. It is a ruse.

 

Again, I highly recommen the power of nightmares. Adam Curtis tells it like it is.



#169 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:46 PM


Don't forget that future administrations are going to have at least the same authority to do what Obama is doing now whether you have that same faith in them or not. Just imagine a Bush/Cheney White House with the "legal right" to target and kill Americans they deem "terrorists" while remembering that OWS protesters were treated and investigated as such even under Obama.

 

A little police pushing and pepper spraying will be the least of the worries for those protesting next time around.

 

Can you please clarify this passive aggresive comment?

 

I read it to say, do not protest, protesters may be droned since this president has killed americans in the past?

 

:facepalm:



#170 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:48 PM

I was with you until the end.

 

 

What would you call the group of individuals who are still planning ot want to do terrorist acts?  My point is name or no name, there is a group out there that is organized enough to pull off elaborate actions to cause terror.

 

Well, in syria, we call them freedom fighters. We called them that in Lybia too. It turns out that these freedom fighters associate or are part of the database code name 'Al Qaeda". See how that works?



#171 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:51 PM

They aren't organized. That is the point. These are people who wish to cause backlash, or as teh CIA puts it, blowback for foreign policy measures the US takes in a given region. NOW, the cat is out of the bag. Watch the power of Nightmares. This entire thing is completely manufactured. Completely. Now that the world at large believes in the mountian bunker sleeper cell high organized terror organization, they have claimed some legitimacy. They use this creation for power and for their cause. In 2001 and before there was NO SUCH THING as an organization, or any organized terrorism that spanned the globe. It is a ruse.

 

Again, I highly recommen the power of nightmares. Adam Curtis tells it like it is.

 

Is a small network of people (in the range of 10-2000) an organization?  Because that is what terrorist cells exist as, in my opinion.  

 

Because the attacks are so organized, the media / governments sell it as an organization?



#172 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:55 PM

How can one formulate an opinion about the size, scope and organization of a "terror cell"?

 

Seriously, if you want to understand this whole thing, I highly recommend taking the 3 hours out to watch Power of Nightmares. Take notes and do some research on the parts you think are bullshit. I did this a few years back. The whole thing is a giant ruse. Manufactured to create a new boogeyman to make imperialist foreign policies, such as the PNAC, seem legitimate. It's a speck of truth stretched to its absolute limit. The true Big Fish story.



#173 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:08 PM

How can one formulate an opinion about the size, scope and organization of a "terror cell"?

 

I thought that was the CIA's job.  Not to become the executive branch's lacky.

 

I guess my point is that I think they do exist, just not as organized and as prolific as the media and government want the public to believe.

 

 

Seriously, if you want to understand this whole thing, I highly recommend taking the 3 hours out to watch Power of Nightmares. Take notes and do some research on the parts you think are bullshit. I did this a few years back. The whole thing is a giant ruse. Manufactured to create a new boogeyman to make imperialist foreign policies, such as the PNAC, seem legitimate. It's a speck of truth stretched to its absolute limit. The true Big Fish story.

 

I will take your word for it.  I doubt I will be spending three houras watching this.  I mean I never watched Dances with Wolves because it was 3 hours. :lol:

 

 

This point is why we go in circles.  This makes me think that any terrorist claimed to be one, is actually not true.  

 

Are terrorists just internation criminals trying to pull off a big score, and except money as the prize dead people is the prize?

 

so instead of using drones, we should send in Interpol?

 

 

That would make this a completely different argument in my opinion.



#174 Joker

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:27 PM

Equating a local dick cop man handling Tabbooma's friends to the Presidents policy is quite reaching

I agree, that is a reach.  My point is you're trusting the government to do the right thing and the government has already labeled Tabbooma's friends (and quite possibly Tabbooma himself) as terrorists. Now imagine what an administration that you don't trust might do.



#175 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:33 PM

No, Tabbooma has faith in the President and that he is a good man and do the right thing.... Tabbooma does not fear being on any list nor the consequences of his past

I agree, that is a reach.  My point is you're trusting the government to do the right thing and the government has already labeled Tabbooma's friends (and quite possibly Tabbooma himself) as terrorists. Now imagine what an administration that you don't trust might do.


#176 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:42 PM

Tabbooma is an Apeman ;)

 



#177 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:45 PM

I agree, that is a reach.  My point is you're trusting the government to do the right thing and the government has already labeled Tabbooma's friends (and quite possibly Tabbooma himself) as terrorists. Now imagine what an administration that you don't trust might do.

 

I too am ok with living in America.  And i agree with Tabooma that the government best efforts are just that, not a conspiracy to kill US citizens.



#178 Joker

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:47 PM

Tabbooma is an Apeman ;)

I'm telling you man, you've got to think about the next administration and how much they can be trusted with the same power. 

 

1086858.jpg



#179 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:48 PM

The governments best effort fucking sucks. I'd rather hire a few Eagle Scouts who can read and hand them a copy of the constitution. :funny1:



#180 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:54 PM

Tabbooma and friends got kicked out of the boyscouts for smoking the good stuff on a camping trip ;) Either quit or they were going to turn us over to our parents



#181 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:55 PM

I'm telling you man, you've got to think about the next administration and how much they can be trusted with the same power. 

 

1086858.jpg

 

Guess you did not read my comment about Obama trying to put a rule book in place so that Future Administrations could not do what you have been complaining about for weeks.

 

 

 

 

Obama 'drone-warfare rulebook' condemned by human rights groups

http://www.guardian....arfare-rulebook

 

I think their may have been over statement of power by the executive branch but at least they recognize this and are trying to put something in place.

 

 

 



#182 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:55 PM

Well, to become an Eagle Scout you have to pass a lot of tests and you cant get kicked out.



#183 concert andy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:56 PM

The governments best effort fucking sucks. I'd rather hire a few Eagle Scouts who can read and hand them a copy of the constitution. :funny1:

 

 

I do not disagree, but I believe in people doing what is right more often than not.


Government included.



#184 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:57 PM

Should I post snippets from The Anatomy of the State again. :lol:



#185 JBetty

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:01 PM

Well, to become an Eagle Scout you have to pass a lot of tests and you cant get kicked out.

 

 

 

You can if you're gay. 



#186 Tabbooma

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:01 PM

Save that for wormtown ;)

Should I post snippets from The Anatomy of the State again. :lol:


#187 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:03 PM

Save that for wormtown ;)

 

Thanks for the reminder. I have to get strange creek tickets!



#188 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:04 PM

You can if you're gay. 

 

No, I mean you can not become Eagle if you get kicked out of the Boy Scouts. Sadly, I find the organization offensive over the stance they have on sexual orientation.



#189 JBetty

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:09 PM

No, I mean you can not become Eagle if you get kicked out of the Boy Scouts. Sadly, I find the organization offensive over the stance they have on sexual orientation.

 

 

:funny1:   That make much more sense.

 

Seems the BS's may finally be ready to make the necessary changes.

Kicking and screaming the whole way.



#190 Uncle Coulro

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 09:18 PM

And further research shows Al-Qaida, literally means "the database".

It means "the base" or "the foundation" (as in a building.) In fact the word "qaeda" is even used by charitable foundations.

 

Some of you are misunderstanding Cook. He meant there's no hierarchical group, but Al Qaeda does exist. OBL's philosophy was to establish a blueprint for action (the Foundation) that could be reproduced by splinter cells. This type of guerrilla "organization" was refined by Goyaałé (aka Geronimo) back in the 1860s, and has been the pattern of direct action cells since the early 1900s.



#191 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 09:25 PM

It means "the base" or "the foundation" (as in a building.) In fact the word "qaeda" is even used by charitable foundations.

 

Some of you are misunderstanding Cook. He meant there's no hierarchical group, but Al Qaeda does exist. OBL's philosophy was to establish a blueprint for action (the Foundation) that could be reproduced by splinter cells. This type of guerrilla "organization" was refined by Goyaałé (aka Geronimo) back in the 1860s, and has been the pattern of direct action cells since the early 1900s.

 

Hence it's not a an organized, giant octopus spanning the globe. OBL was tied to "Al Qaeda" through the trial of four men in febuary of 2001 over the 1998 embassy bombings. It's all neatly done in the ten minute snippet from Power of Nightmares. These radical militants were given the spot light and siezed the moment. Even though their philosophy was largely rejected by those living in places like Eqgypt because these types would turn on anyone, including each other, for not being "Muslim enough".

 

There was and isn't any cave fortresses or a large, highly organized terrorist army. It's completely fabricated.



#192 china cat

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:22 PM

What would you call the group of individuals who are still planning ot want to do terrorist acts?

 

u.s foreign policy makers?



#193 china cat

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:27 PM

Hence it's not a an organized, giant octopus spanning the globe. OBL was tied to "Al Qaeda" through the trial of four men in febuary of 2001 over the 1998 embassy bombings. It's all neatly done in the ten minute snippet from Power of Nightmares. These radical militants were given the spot light and siezed the moment. Even though their philosophy was largely rejected by those living in places like Eqgypt because these types would turn on anyone, including each other, for not being "Muslim enough".

 

There was and isn't any cave fortresses or a large, highly organized terrorist army. It's completely fabricated.

 

would be a great documentary selection for club. Will find time to watch, regardless.

 

http://topdocumentar...-of-nightmares/



#194 Joker

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 01:52 PM

Guess you did not read my comment about Obama trying to put a rule book in place so that Future Administrations could not do what you have been complaining about for weeks.

"To say they are rewriting the rulebook implies that there isn't already a rulebook" said Jameel Jaffer, the director of the American Civil Liberties Union's Center for Democracy. "But what they are already doing is rejecting a rulebook – of international law – that has been in place since [the second world war]."



#195 concert andy

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:39 PM

u.s foreign policy makers?

 

Very cynical around here.

 

:rolleyes:



#196 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:43 PM

Very cynical around here.

 

:rolleyes:

 

More like realistic. As they are the true terrorists. Then pass the label off onto others who don't like their imperialist policy, or their family being miamed and killed, etc...

 

It's the same thing asd calling the "Al Qaeda" in Syria fighting Assad, or the ones in Lybia that fought Kaddafhi, as "freedom fighters", while when these same militants are fighting against the US foreign policies and interests, they are labeled terrorists.

 

See how that works?



#197 concert andy

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:51 PM

More like realistic. As they are the true terrorists. Then pass the label off onto others who don't like their imperialist policy, or their family being miamed and killed, etc...

 

It's the same thing asd calling the "Al Qaeda" in Syria fighting Assad, or the ones in Lybia that fought Kaddafhi, as "freedom fighters", while when these same militants are fighting against the US foreign policies and interests, they are labeled terrorists.

 

See how that works?

 

I see how you understand it to work.  

 

Just more cynisism IMO.



#198 concert andy

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:54 PM

"To say they are rewriting the rulebook implies that there isn't already a rulebook" said Jameel Jaffer, the director of the American Civil Liberties Union's Center for Democracy. "But what they are already doing is rejecting a rulebook – of international law – that has been in place since [the second world war]."

 

As I have stated all along, then the international law enforcers should enforce these laws and hold the US and the administration accountable.

 

From the way TASB describes "terrorists", this is not a job for drones, or military, or snipers.

 

This is Interpol's job.



#199 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:55 PM

So the US is doing good things spreading democracy, and these types are just hardcore religious fanatics that hate us for our freedoms?

Is that less cynical, or is it just more palatable?



#200 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:56 PM

What international law enforcement? The US military , CIA and foreign policy script writers?