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King 1963: I have a dream. Obama 2013: I have a drone


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#1 Joker

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 09:04 PM

King 1963: I have a dream. Obama 2013: I have a drone

 

http://sluggerotoole...i-have-a-drone/

 

 

In 1963 Martin Luther King Jr stood on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial in Washington, D.C., and gave his famous “I have a dream” speech. Today, fifty years on, in tribute to the great civil rights leader, the US marks Martin Luther King Jr Day with a federal holiday in his name.

 

Today also sees Barack Obama take to the steps of the city’s Capitol Building for his second public inauguration as President of the United States of America. There is no escaping the echoes from half a century ago, not least because Obama has chosen to use MLK’s bible, alongside Lincoln’s, for his swearing in ceremony.

 

With such powerful symbolism on show, one can’t help but draw comparisons between Obama and King. If some see Obama, as the country’s first black president, as the realisation of at least part of King’s dream, many also see Obama’s record as a war leader at odds with the nonviolent vision of King.

 

While King had a dream, Obama has a drone.

 

Under Obama, the US government has relied increasingly on drones to kill terror suspects. According to reports, more than 2,500 people have been killed in over 300 drone strikes since Obama took office. US drone attacks have more than doubled overall in Pakistan during the Obama administration, and drones are also now being used far afield, from Yemen to Libya.

 

Of course, some of those killed likely have been “bad guys”. But that’s not really the point; at least, not if you believe in the rule of law.

 

As AI USA has noted: “We know that among those killed were some who were essentially accused in secret of crimes or other wrongdoing but in respect of whom no efforts were made to bring them to justice in a court of law. We know that there were others about whom the government had no specific information but who may simply have been in the wrong place at the wrong time. We know that among those killed have been men of different ages, women, and children. We also know that every one of the people the government has killed, whoever they were and whatever they may have been believed to have done, had the right not to be arbitrarily deprived of his or her life.”

 

Obama’s administration has continued to rely on his predecessor’s “global war” legal theory that treats the entire world as a battlefield between the USA and armed groups, on which lethal force may potentially be used virtually anywhere at any time without regard to human rights standards. News that there are now moves afoot to allow the drone killing campaign to continue without restrictions in Pakistan is deeply worrying.

 

Such an approach is not only of concern in its own right, it also weakens the credibility of the USA in advocating for respect for human rights by other states and sets dangerous precedents for other states to adopt to justify their own unlawful killings, so eroding further the foundations of the international legal framework which protect us all.

 

President Obama was granted the 2009 Nobel Peace Prize more for what he might deliver, than for what he had accomplished. He has four short years left to build a legacy of peace and respect for human rights which would merit the award.

 

He could start by ensuring that his use of drones comes into line with international law.



#2 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 02:31 PM

Yes we can...

 

 

...Here we go again.



#3 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 02:35 PM

Again? This is an ongoing situation.



#4 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:12 PM

Again? This is an ongoing situation.

 

 

I saw this analogy weeks ago, in Meme's.

 

Again?  Must be a new week, so it must be time to put up another Obama drone thread.  

 

In Case you are keeping score at home.  This is not a new subject, just a different spin from the weekly Joker update. 



#5 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:22 PM

Oh definitely not a new subject and it's something that I'm sure I'll be posting about again. 

 

I posted this one because of the MLK connection



#6 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:25 PM

Why must you post about subjects that you follow here, joker? Can't you just let it go already? Andy already saw about the drones in another thread. And we know you only post to get Andy to reply. :lmao:



#7 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:25 PM

Oh definitely not a new subject and it's something that I'm sure I'll be posting about again. 

 

I posted this one because of the MLK connection

 

Oh I know.

 

Hence, here we go again.

 

And the (IMO) now meant to be a mocking slogan,yes we can!



#8 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:27 PM

Why must you post about subjects that you follow here, joker? Can't you just let it go already? Andy already saw about the drones in another thread. And we know you only post to get Andy to reply. :lmao:

 

I love how you make the story somehow about me.

 

When it was really about you two, and obviously it worked.



#9 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:30 PM

:lmao:



#10 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:32 PM

FTR I don't think I've started more than a handful of threads on the subject. I don't feel that that is an excessive amount especially considering the ramifications involved with the program and it's lack of any clear policy or regulation.



#11 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:37 PM

FTR I don't think I've started more than a handful of threads on the subject. I don't feel that that is an excessive amount especially considering the ramifications involved with the program and it's lack of any clear policy or regulation.

 

 

4 a month still equates to 1 a week.



#12 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:50 PM

Totally excessive, joker. Andy says one per month is sufficient.



#13 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:51 PM

4 a month still equates to 1 a week.

How long has Obama been using drones and how many threads have I started on the subject? I'm betting it's far less than one per week



#14 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:54 PM

Ok I just searched and I've started 5 with drone or drones in the title going back to last august, you've got 2 during the same period. So what is too many in your eyes?



#15 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:55 PM

Andy says more than one per month is excessive.



#16 TEO

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:56 PM

Who cares?  Is anyone being forced to open and subsequently read any thread?     :spank:



#17 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:58 PM

Aha, this only makes 5 in 6 months so I'm still within the limit   :woot:



#18 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:59 PM

Andy says more than one per month is excessive.

 

 

Wow.  You really do make it about me.  Joker commented the following:

 

FTR I don't think I've started more than a handful of threads on the subject. I don't feel that that is an excessive amount especially considering the ramifications involved with the program and it's lack of any clear policy or regulation.

 

He said he did not think it was excessive.  All I stated that he posts this once a week, which also means if you post 4 times a month that is sill once a week on average.

 

Wow!

 

What do you have against me that it is always about me?  So what I do not share your opinion lock step.  Jeebus.



#19 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:59 PM

Yes. Joker is egging Andy on to open and read the threads about the drones. He's doing it deliberately to mock Andy as an Obama voter.



#20 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:02 PM

Yes. Joker is egging Andy on to open and read the threads about the drones. He's doing it deliberately to mock Andy as an Obama voter.

 

Nope, again making it about me.

 

Why is it all about me. 



#21 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:03 PM


Aha, this only makes 5 in 6 months so I'm still within the limit   :woot:

 

Should I go through all the threads and bump them to prove this or is it still about me?



#22 TEO

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:03 PM

Get a room.



#23 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:06 PM

Should I go through all the threads and bump them to prove this or is it still about me?

Please do, like I said I only see a handful that I started



#24 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:07 PM

Nope, again making it about me.

 

Why is it all about me. 

 

Maybe because you made it about you and how many threads joker starts on the subject. We could use a few bulb change outs in here it seems.



#25 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:16 PM

Maybe because you made it about you and how many threads joker starts on the subject. We could use a few bulb change outs in here it seems.

 

So now you are jumping the shark.

 

 

Let me get this straight.

 

You can post Yes we can, but I can not?

 

Why is that?  Because that is all I did here, and 20 posts later it is about me.  I think it is more about you and wanting to be right, than anything I actually post.



#26 Tim the Beek

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:24 PM

So what is an acceptable frequency at which to post threads about an ongoing program which one finds morally repugnant and Unconstitutional?



#27 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:40 PM

Please do, like I said I only see a handful that I started

 

 

I went through the posts.  There were 5 since November 25 Day after Thanksgiving   May be it is all the other threads where this point (like the New Mexico thread) where this point of drones was thrown into the discussion for no apparent reason other than to further hammering Obama (right or wrong, but Joker seems to want to make sure we all know about this (which we do)).



#28 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:41 PM

So what is an acceptable frequency at which to post threads about an ongoing program which one finds morally repugnant and Unconstitutional?

 

 

You can post it is often as you like, but try not to let it seep into every other conversation.  but you are OK to do it if you like.

 

but if I say something, it becomes about me.



#29 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:48 PM

I went through the posts.  There were 5 since November 25 Day after Thanksgiving   May be it is all the other threads where this point (like the New Mexico thread) where this point of drones was thrown into the discussion for no apparent reason other than to further hammering Obama (right or wrong, but Joker seems to want to make sure we all know about this (which we do)).

Really? 5 since Thanksgiving? Then please point them out as you said you would, because I can't find them.

 

Seems to me this is just another case of you talking shit about me that you can't back up because it's just not true.



#30 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 04:58 PM

Wow!  You really do not like me and think I am spewing shit about you any chance I get.

 

 

I do apologize as I counted 4 the second time, must have counted one twice the first time.  But here are the links...

 

This thread counts as 1.

 

#2

http://www.gathering...-rights-groups/

 

#3

http://www.gathering...entury-america/

 

#4

http://www.gathering...lled-by-drones/



#31 MeOmYo

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:00 PM

that is a shit ton of threads right there



#32 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:01 PM

But there are a few other threads a week that you make this "American killed by a drone" comment in.  If it is not its own thread, it is throw out there by you.  

 

This is what skews my impression.



#33 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:02 PM

that is a shit ton of threads right there

 

 

So the other threads hi-jacked to include drones (by joker) do not count.  Like the New Mexico thread?

 

OK.



#34 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:04 PM

So now you are jumping the shark.

 

 

Let me get this straight.

 

You can post Yes we can, but I can not?

 

Why is that?  Because that is all I did here, and 20 posts later it is about me.  I think it is more about you and wanting to be right, than anything I actually post.

 

What are you babbling about, fella? I never said anything about the yes we can slogan. Use it all you want. What Im pointing out is that you came in here ONLY to point out that joker is starting too many drone threads for your liking. Which  is about you, dude. It's about how you dont like it, or find jokers posts excessive on the subject. At which time the thread changed from being about the OP, to being about how many postings on a subject are considered excessive according to Andy.

 

This has nothing to do with being right about anything. Jeebus. :lmao:



#35 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:04 PM

Sorry I will change my statement, 4 threads in 8 weeks..

 

Once every other week.  But the point is we know Joker is against Obama and his drone policy, which I am too, but that does  not matter.

 

Yes we can!



#36 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:07 PM

WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!

 

100903HappyDays1.jpg



#37 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:11 PM

What are you babbling about, fella? I never said anythign abotu the yes we can slogan. Use it all you want. What Im pointing out is that you came in here ONLY to point out that joker is starting too many drone threads for your liking. Which  is about you, dude. It's abotu hwo you dont like it, or find jokers posts excessive on the subject. At which time the thread changed from being about the OP, to being about how many postings on a subject are considered excessive according to Andy.

 

This has nothign to do with being right about anything. Jeebus. :lmao:

 

So I was wrong on the exact number, the other threads hijacked by drones talk, I am sure is at 4 over the past 8 weeks (and we have one from today to boot), which implies once a week.  This is just my opinion.  

 

Sorry if my semantics do not meet you approval.

 

 

 

 

Yes we can!



#38 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:11 PM

WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!

 

100903HappyDays1.jpg

 

 

There is the declaration.

 

 

 

TASB the jump the shark moderator!



#39 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:13 PM

Wow!  You really do not like me and think I am spewing shit about you any chance I get.

 

 

I do apologize as I counted 4 the second time, must have counted one twice the first time.  But here are the links...

 

This thread counts as 1.

 

#2

http://www.gathering...-rights-groups/

 

#3

http://www.gathering...entury-america/

 

#4

http://www.gathering...lled-by-drones/

You're the one that came in here giving me a hard time, not the other way around.

 

Did you count how many drone threads you've started in that same period? I know you've already started 2 yourself in the last few weeks.

 

As far as the Mexico thread goes I never once mentioned drones or Obama.

 

Again, it comes down to you not liking what I have to say so you just start spewing shit about me that isn't true.

 

Don't bother apologizing for it, it's obvious you don't mean it because you just keep doing it.



#40 TakeAStepBack

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:15 PM

So I was wrong on the exact number, the other threads hijacked by drones talk, I am sure is at 4 over the past 8 weeks (and we have one from today to boot), which implies once a week.  This is just my opinion.  

 

Sorry if my semantics do not meet you approval.

 

 

 

 

Yes we can!

OK, start a thread.

 

:lmao:

 

It appears this has gone several miles over your head....



#41 MeOmYo

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:16 PM

this is like an enormous word problem gone horribly wrong..



#42 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:34 PM

You're the one that came in here giving me a hard time, not the other way around.

 

Did you count how many drone threads you've started in that same period? I know you've already started 2 yourself in the last few weeks.

 

As far as the Mexico thread goes I never once mentioned drones or Obama.

 

Again, it comes down to you not liking what I have to say so you just start spewing shit about me that isn't true.

 

Don't bother apologizing for it, it's obvious you don't mean it because you just keep doing it.

 

Really, what about me asking you about killing americans using drones, and linking that to the 2nd amendment?

 

That did not happen?  I will go quote it so you know what the F I am talking about.

 

I stated two threads because ultimately I agree with you on the subject.  But somehow I spewing shit about you.

 

I did not apologize for anything except counting 5 instead of 4.

 

I stated I agree with you in general, except that the kid may or may have not been guilty.  You think it does not matter.  Other than that, we agree on drones.

 

 

 

Spewing  :shit:



#43 MeOmYo

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:35 PM

the plot thickens

 

:popcorn:



#44 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:38 PM

the plot thickens

 

:popcorn:

 

 

No it doesn't.

 

I am wrong, joker will always be right.  



#45 JBetty

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:58 PM

albatross-l-stare.jpg



#46 TEO

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:58 PM

So, why drones?  To make killing easier, less personalized?  To make best use of the video game generation as killing machines?  To potentially spy and kill without being killed?



#47 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:06 PM

So, why drones?  To make killing easier, less personalized?  To make best use of the video game generation as killing machines?  To potentially spy and kill without being killed?

 

 

So we do not have to answer to anyone, because the commander in chief decides who is a threat and who is not a threat.

 

The point is we need drones, and we need military personal, but not just drones.  It seems Obama is going more towards drone strikes to protect american soldiers more and more.

 

Joker has a problem that we targeted and killed a 16 year old american even though his father was a terrorist.  I said may be the son would do anything for his fathers love, and may be joined, or may be he believed as his father did.

 

but we will never know which is Jokers belabored point.  If we can kill an american without due process, what else can the government do.  

 

I agree to a point.  I want more info, which the white house says is classified. 

 

but I still reserve my right to view all the facts, which makes me wrong, as joker stated clearly to me in another thread.



#48 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:06 PM

Really, what about me asking you about killing americans using drones, and linking that to the 2nd amendment?

I don't understand what you're trying to say here.

That did not happen?  I will go quote it so you know what the F I am talking about.

I responded in that thread. Like I said there, my point was that our government has targeted and executed Americans and there's no reason to think it won't happen again. Their use of drones to do it isn't the issue, it's the fact that they are killing Americans and we should be allowed to defend ourselves in the event they continue to do so.

I stated two threads because ultimately I agree with you on the subject.  But somehow I spewing shit about you.

Yes, you're "spewing shit" about me when you say things like I'm starting drone threads every week.

I did not apologize for anything except counting 5 instead of 4.

 

I stated I agree with you in general, except that the kid may or may have not been guilty.  You think it does not matter.  Other than that, we agree on drones.

 

 

 

Spewing  :shit:



#49 Joker

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:08 PM

but I still reserve my right to view all the facts, which makes me wrong, as joker stated clearly to me in another thread.

 

Where did I say you were wrong for wanting to view all the facts?



#50 concert andy

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:09 PM

I don't understand what you're trying to say here.

I responded in that thread. Like I said there, my point was that our government has targeted and executed Americans and there's no reason to think it won't happen again. Their use of drones to do it isn't the issue, it's the fact that they are killing Americans and we should be allowed to defend ourselves in the event they continue to do so.

Yes, you're "spewing shit" about me when you say things like I'm starting drone threads every week.

 

What you dont understand is you spewed shit about me.  You said you never referenced oboma in the New Mexico thread and you did.

 

 

And I said sorry, once every other week.

 

 

But like I said, you will always be right.