154 replies to this topic

[Jersey Thug]

This is a real conundrum, because usually what women say they really want, they end up not actually being happy with once they actually get it.

if i fell for a guy who had all of those characteristics i mentioned, but we had intrinsic differences that still made us incompatible, sure, i wouldn't be happy in that relationship and it would eventually fail, as most relationships eventually do. if life-long committed love was easy or common, the divorce rate wouldn't be nearly as high as it is.

by the way, you could be all the wonderful stuff i listed and one highly generalized, insulting comment about women (such as the one i quoted above) would still make me run for the hills.

[china cat]

agreed, thuggie

you might date someone who does not have the characteristics you need in order for the relationship to last long term (those relationships are often the building blocks that help you identify what you are and are not looking for), but you might still causally date them.

I'd date someone who didn't have all of the characteristics I mentioned in my first post, but would prolly not marry him

some qualities are a must though, with effective communication and conflict resolution at the top of the list. If someone doesn't resolve conflict well, I'm out. no question about it. resorting to name calling, blame-shifting, manipulation... ugh. total deal-breaker

Thug, you also made me realize another deal breaker: if he's obsessed with porn, wants breast implants, listens to Stern, goes to strip clubs... nope, not for me.

[Tim the Beek]

...wants breast implants...

You don't think I'd look good with a bigger, firmer rack?

[Tim the Beek]

Oh, and it strikes me how little thought I ever put toward the stuff in this thread, as I didn't believe there was much in the way of a really good match out there for me.

I was wrong.

[china cat]

You don't think I'd look good with a bigger, firmer rack?

I want you to be comfortable with your small rack, baby. It's enough for me

[hoagie]

Once you accept that "you cant always get what you want", you will start finding LOTS of people who are worthy of getting into a relationship with. Also, it helps to realize that there is no real "forever" in any relationship, eventually, one partner leaes the other, one way pr another. So its best to just enjoy it while you can, and never sweat the small stuff.

Sorry if my earlier comment offended you Jerseythug.

[KrisNYG]

<------- Will never accept not getting what I want. That translates to settling imo, and I do not settle. I'd rather be alone. Sometimes it can take a while to realize this but when I do I am out. And before you start nitpicking this post (HaTH) I am speaking of the big things, not small annoyances. We all have personal traits that grind on others... except me, I am perfect. (yeah right).



Agreed CC, except for going to strip clubs... those can be fun!

[china cat]

<------- Will never accept not getting what I want. That translates to settling imo, and I do not settle. I'd rather be alone. Sometimes it can take a while to realize this but when I do I am out. And before you start nitpicking this post (HaTH) I am speaking of the big things, not small annoyances. We all have personal traits that grind on others... except me, I am perfect. (yeah right).



Agreed CC, except for going to strip clubs... those can be fun!

amen

42, never married. content on my own - will not settle

glad i waited, cause now i have someone who has all the characteristics that are important to me

so pooey on you mr. hat man

[Tim the Beek]

...cause now i have someone who has all the characteristics that are important to me

Who is he?

[KrisNYG]

amen

42, never married. content on my own - will not settle

glad i waited, cause now i have someone who has all the characteristics that are important to me

so pooey on you mr. hat man

I knew you were lying about your age in that pic!

Yep, no thank you! Of course I'll prolly die with a hundred dogs being my only companions but that's okay.

[TEO]

I like getting what I need.

[hoagie]

You call it "settling", i call it acceptting that people have foibles, flaws, and eccentricities. Thats not to say that you should date someone who is incompatible eith you...but i feel if you have a certain "standard" a man must meet before you feel you can have a meaningful relationship, you very well may end up alone a lot.

My point is just that its probably better to keep an open mind, than to have the bar set so high that nice datable guys fall by the wayside as u wait for someone that may not exist.

And when u fid te one who you never want to let go, realize that the person will die someday, so it will never be "forever".

[TEO]

Forever may be a discussion based on "essence" "energy" time, dimensions, etc.

[china cat]

You call it "settling", i call it acceptting that people have foibles, flaws, and eccentricities. Thats not to say that you should date someone who is incompatible eith you...but i feel if you have a certain "standard" a man must meet before you feel you can have a meaningful relationship, you very well may end up alone a lot.

My point is just that its probably better to keep an open mind, than to have the bar set so high that nice datable guys fall by the wayside as u wait for someone that may not exist.

And when u fid te one who you never want to let go, realize that the person will die someday, so it will never be "forever".

of course there will be differences but obsessing over porn, arguing like a 2 year old having a tantrum, eating 16 oz steaks 4 times a week, and calling several times a day to check in on me due to control/jealousy issues are not foibles, flaws, and eccentricities to me, they are deal breakers.

there's a difference between personality traits and matters of character and compatibility.

and I'd much rather be alone (as I have been for years at a time) than accept what doesn't work for me

[KrisNYG]

-----> "You call it "settling", i call it acceptting that people have foibles, flaws, and eccentricities."

I already covered this, I do not expect anyone to be perfect but certain things are non negotiable. And I LOVE men that are eccentric, absolutely NOT a flaw! Actually I should add "must be eccentric" to my original list!

-----> "if you have a certain "standard" a man must meet before you feel you can have a meaningful relationship, you very well may end up alone a lot."

Fine by me! I'm rather fond of my own company, have no problem flying solo!

-------> "as u wait for someone that may not exist."

I am quite certain "that person" does exist. Why on earth would you want to have "fillers" that could prevent you from "that person" when they present?

[KrisNYG]

-----> "And when u fid te one who you never want to let go, realize that the person will die someday, so it will never be "forever"."

What if you go out together? Ya know... like in a barrel going over Niagra Falls or something else equally epic? What then?


Cause something like that is the way I plan on checking outta here!

[Jersey Thug]

there's a difference between personality traits and matters of character and compatibility.

big difference. a personality trait that i find endearing in my husband might be annoying to others, whereas someone who cheats, steals, lies, hurls insults in the heat of the moment or is otherwise abusive will be a lousy partner to anyone. that doesn't mean nobody will accept them as a partner...but those are character traits that that don't make them a good partner.

on a related note, i just read a book that explained that due to difference in the male and female brain, (in general) men will accept and adjust to situations that don't make them happy in relationships, while women will generally seek to repair the situation or get out of it if that's not possible.

which might go a long way toward explaining why this is one topic we'd be unlikely to meet in the middle about

and Hoagie there is no reason to apologize for saying what you really think. i actually prefer to know these things about people. so thanks.

[Ginger Snap]

big difference. a personality trait that i find endearing in my husband might be annoying to others, whereas someone who cheats, steals, lies, hurls insults in the heat of the moment or is otherwise abusive will be a lousy partner to anyone. that doesn't mean nobody will accept them as a partner...but those are character traits that that don't make them a good partner.

on a related note, i just read a book that explained that due to difference in the male and female brain, (in general) men will accept and adjust to situations that don't make them happy in relationships, while women will generally seek to repair the situation or get out of it if that's not possible.

which might go a long way toward explaining why this is one topic we'd be unlikely to meet in the middle about

and Hoagie there is no reason to apologize for saying what you really think. i actually prefer to know these things about people. so thanks.

I'd like to read that book. I know several women including myself who have often made what I call "silent adjustments" or what others may call "compromising themselves" for the sake of the relationship. Hell- that was 2006 to 2009? and then again, and again...

[KrisNYG]

I'd like to read that book. I know several women including myself who have often made what I call "silent adjustments" or what others may call "compromising themselves" for the sake of the relationship. Hell- that was 2006 to 2009? and then again, and again...

But I'd bet you got the F out after realizing your error in judgement, cause yer smrt!

I think we've all done dumb things in our past regarding self compromise, I sure as hell have! Don't worry Wit, when you get old like me you'll be far less tolerant and prolly jaded as well.

[Jersey Thug]

i spoke about this book in another L&S thread recently - it's The Brain in Love by Daniel Amen, MD.

http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/0307587894

[Jersey Thug]

of course not every breakup or divorce is initiated by the woman, but i've read from several sources that women do the leaving 2/3 of the time. the guy might be all but absent in the relationship, but in the majority of cases he won't say the words or pack a bag, and often acts shocked when the women says "enough".

(i know that's happened to me in just about every relationship i've been in. even when i've stayed WAY longer than i felt i should have, the guy still communicated that he was happy with us, and didn't understand that something was off even if i thought it should be obvious to me, to him, and to anyone we spent time with.)

anyway, some of that 2/3 statistic surely can be attributed to laws governing divorce and custody, etc (the financial hit and custody laws favoring women are a strong motivation to stay in an unhappy situation for many men) but not all of it. that book and other things i've read recently suggest that the same brain activity that that pushes women to talk about the relationship (our connection to the amygdala) also makes us sit up and take notice when the relationship is failing, rather than seek a long term work-around as men are wired to do.

[Ginger Snap]

of course not every breakup or divorce is initiated by the woman, but i've read from several sources that women do the leaving 2/3 of the time. the guy might be all but absent in the relationship, but in the majority of cases he won't say the words or pack a bag, and often acts shocked when the women says "enough".

(i know that's happened to me in just about every relationship i've been in. even when i've stayed WAY longer than i felt i should have, the guy still communicated that he was happy with us, and didn't understand that something was off even if i thought it should be obvious to me, to him, and to anyone we spent time with.)

anyway, some of that 2/3 statistic surely can be attributed to laws governing divorce and custody, etc (the financial hit and custody laws favoring women are a strong motivation to stay in an unhappy situation for many men) but not all of it. that book and other things i've read recently suggest that the same brain activity that that pushes women to talk about the relationship (our connection to the amygdala) also makes us sit up and take notice when the relationship is failing, rather than seek a long term work-around as men are wired to do.

This is not true- far more women end up in poverty than men after divorce.


edit: I have more to say than that but I'm cooking.

[Jersey Thug]

i'm talking about how our brains work and the reasons behind our decision making and how that varies between the two sexes. men do take a financial hit and oftentimes do not get primary custody...and apparently, that's a motivating factor for them.

women may end up in poverty in the process, but we're programmed differently and oftentimes will make different choices for ourselves and our children if the situation demands it.

i can see why the way i structured that sentence might read to you as "divorce impacts men negatively, and women positively" but that isn't what i wrote or what i intended to imply. custody laws largely favor women, and men do take a financial hit. neither of those statements is intended to suggest that the woman doesn't also take a financial hit, or that divorce negatively impacts him more than her...just that her decision making process isn't ruled by thoughts of finance.

i hope that's more clear.

i've done more reading to support this and my own experience backs up a lot of what i've read with regard to the differences in brain structure and chemistry between men and women. i find it really interesting and often apt, but i'm not saying other science wouldn't contradict THIS science. what are the chances of that?

[hoagie]

-----> "And when u fid te one who you never want to let go, realize that the person will die someday, so it will never be "forever"."

What if you go out together? Ya know... like in a barrel going over Niagra Falls or something else equally epic? What then?


Cause something like that is the way I plan on checking outta here!

how incredible romantic! I dig it

"if you cant be with the one you love, love the one you're with"

[KrisNYG]

In other words, I philosophically blew your mind... didn't I. Success!

[hoagie]

In other words, I philosophically blew your mind... didn't I. Success!

it isn't tough to do!

[KrisNYG]

You're a good sport, HaTH!

[hoagie]

I just disagree with you ladies in the respect that, I'd rather date someone and have romantic experiences with people I initially like. Sometimes, it only l;asts several months. Sometimes maybe even a few years...but if it doesn't work out for the long term, I would never be devastated anymore, because there is ALWAYS another person out there...

At the end of August, I walked away from Newton Crosby after 3 years of making music, and I had to do it because I was not happy anymore in the situation I found myself having to deal with, and it came down to huge personality conflicts between one of the guys and me. It was the toughest decision I have ever made in my life, because man, we made some fantastic music. But in the end, I had to face the fact that I really don't want to play music when Im not having fun....

I suppose it is exactly the same in a relationship for most women. If it isn't fun and rewarding, why even bother. I get it./

[Eco]

This is not true- far more women end up in poverty than men after divorce.


edit: I have more to say than that but I'm cooking.

I'm interested in what more you can add. Speaking from my own experiences, I lived at a fire station after my first divorce because I had no money for rent and now in a room at a friends house since I can't afford to have a third house on my credit and really can't afford a proper apartment with an extra room so my kids can come and spend the night. I have plenty of male friends who work 80-100+ hours a week and live in shit conditions because of what the courts order them to pay. Along the same lines, I know plenty of women who have equally shitty conditions BUT have kids that the have to raise in the same conditions....

[TEO]

I just disagree with you ladies in the respect that, I'd rather date someone and have romantic experiences with people I initially like. Sometimes, it only l;asts several months. Sometimes maybe even a few years...but if it doesn't work out for the long term, I would never be devastated anymore, because there is ALWAYS another person out there...

I get that, however over the years my tolerance for mediocracy has significantly decreased.

[melissaphish]

He has to be 6 feet tall, bald, kind of husky, funny as hell, and named Jim.

[hoagie]

I get that, however over the years my tolerance for mediocracy has significantly decreased.

And I get that, as well.

[melissaphish]

anyway, some of that 2/3 statistic surely can be attributed to laws governing divorce and custody, etc (the financial hit and custody laws favoring women are a strong motivation to stay in an unhappy situation for many men) but not all of it.

It is kind of nuts, really. I understand that laws must be in place to protect the children, but i can't understand why, when my husband and I have his kids for part of every single week, feeding and housing them, that we should pay his ex wife so much money in child support. Especially when she makes like 3x more money than he does. We feed and house them for 2-4 days out of every week. WHY do we have to pay for her to feed and house them for the other times?

[melissaphish]

Also, it helps to realize that there is no real "forever" in any relationship, eventually, one partner leaves the other, one way or another.

That is not true.

[MeOmYo]

It is kind of nuts, really. I understand that laws must be in place to protect the children, but i can't understand why, when my husband and I have his kids for part of every single week, feeding and housing them, that we should pay his ex wife so much money in child support. Especially when she makes like 3x more money than he does. We feed and house them for 2-4 days out of every week. WHY do we have to pay for her to feed and house them for the other times?

Is this the arrangement that was agreed to IN court? If it was something they agreed to after, wouldn't he have to go back through the court system to have it changed?

[melissaphish]

Is this the arrangement that was agreed to IN court? If it was something they agreed to after, wouldn't he have to go back through the court system to have it changed?

Yes. Massachusetts has a formula for child support, so if she has primary custody it does not matter how much time they spend with us, what he has to pay is determined by a mandated formula.

[TEO]

Our of curiosity does MA not have a 50/50 joint custody provision?

[KrisNYG]

Here's my understanding of this in CT regarding traditional support.

Lets say the kid needs $300 a week in total support, not just from one parent (the whole ball of string). There is joint custody with one parent holding primary. The $300 is then divided by who makes what. For example, if the ex wife makes considerably more than she is on the hook for let's say two thirds, the dad is on the hook for one third, therefore he has to pay her since she holds the primary residence. If the child moved in with you two as his/her primary residence, guess what, you'd receive the ex-wife's share and would pay out nothing to her.

[KrisNYG]

Our of curiosity does MA not have a 50/50 joint custody provision?

50/50 really does not exist unless both parents make the same salary and the child chooses to split time evenly.

[TEO]

Gotcha, I generally look at this from a support and # of days perspective.

[Tim the Beek]

50/50 really does not exist unless both parents make the same salary and the child chooses to split time evenly.

Jeez...are you already researching how you're gonna nail him for child support?

[KrisNYG]

Jeez...are you already researching how you're gonna nail him for child support?

You really don't know me at all, do you. Only people that make $ off that shit are the lawyers. My solution would be: copious amounts of booze + pen & life insurance papers = I win.

[Tim the Beek]

[hoagie]

That is not true.

Let me know how not dying works out for u

[melissaphish]

Let me know how not dying works out for u

Well, things last forever for the one who dies first, so all I have to do is make sure that is me!

[hoagie]

Well, things last forever for the one who dies first, so all I have to do is make sure that is me!

So you'll be leaving them first. 2/3 of women agree with you.

[Jwheelz]

I beg to differ, true love does not compel one to overlook, but rather love combined with respect and compassion make idiosyncrasies accepted perhaps endearing, not overlooked or endured.

to clarify, overlooked was probably the wrong term... it looks like when cdrhead said 'look past' which is the statement I referring to when I made mine, I changed it to overlook... but I mean that when you have a really strong connection with someone, even if they don't meet a few (lesser) items on your list of things you look for, you can accept that fact and still enter into a relationship with them...

I'm already in over my head on this topic

I don't have a list per se, just that I want someone who communicates, doesn't have a ton of hangups (or is honestly willing to work through them, not just pay lip service to doing so), is sexually confident... isn't going to be jealous of normal behavior (like me having female friends and talking to women platonically), and I believe that both people in a relationship should not base their entire world around one another but should have their own interests and activities and friends and not be joined at the hip... besides that just basic compatibility... but anyway that's my perspective, and I think there's as many different points of view on this as there are different kinds of people

[cdrhead]

Another thing that just struck me reading through this thread.....a comment from a guy......just the first part "Oh, and it strikes me how little thought I ever put toward the stuff in this thread" .When I meet someone I don't start checking off my list, I realize there is an attraction and go from there

[TEO]

not be joined at the hip...

Agreed, much better to be joined at the pelvis.

[Mama Kel]

Another point to consider is that people change over time. In a long term relationship, the person you entered it with is not necessarily the same person 15 years later. Sure at the core they usually are (a lot of those core characteristics listed) but philosophies change, things of importance change, people grow, people stop growing, kids change everything...etc...there's an ebb & flow to this.

To say 'this is what I want' period. I dunno. For me that has changed over the years. God help me if I had ended up with EXACTLY what I thought I wanted 15 years ago!

But the root of it all has to be love